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Post by moonover on Apr 13, 2017 20:05:05 GMT
I see it differently, I think Klaus and Freya are alike.
I think Elijah and also Freya , see Marcel as a family, but they saw Freya's vision and believed killing Marcel was the only way to protect the rest of the family.
This family is a bunch of monsters, predators. I don't love them because they are always right and always in their right. I love them because they are imperfect and make lousy decisions. I hope they take one road but they choose another, and I still route for them.
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Post by Madamimadam on Apr 13, 2017 20:13:09 GMT
I see it differently, I think Klaus and Freya are alike. I think Elijah and also Freya , see Marcel as a family, but they saw Freya's vision and believed killing Marcel was the only way to protect the rest of the family. This family is a bunch of monsters, predators. I don't love them because they are always right and always in their right. I love them because they are imperfect and make lousy decisions. I hope they take one road but they choose another, and I still route for them. NO Freya does not see Marcel as family. She has only known him for one year which was not really peaceful year, add to it that prophecy. She does not know their history but what you said about Elijah I see your point. The thing is I am not completely sold on it seeing Elijah's attitude towards Marcel LOL. I guess we will find out as the season progresses. Hmmm I dont root for the family anymore. the only thing I root for is Klaus and Hope relationship. This family is messed up and do bad things for their personal gain. It is time they face consequences. I saw Freya like Klaus in season 3 but no, last two episodes have proven me wrong. And when I look back at what Freya did for the family in s3 I think she is more like Elijah. In what sense she is like Klaus? |
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Post by moonover on Apr 13, 2017 20:57:27 GMT
I think she has been introduced as the female version of Klaus, he had abusive childhood raised by Mikael and she had abusive childhood raised by aunt Dalia. As a result they both have this strong need to cling to the bonds of family.
She is human but she is ruthless like Klaus and since he has become father and worries about his daughters opinion I think Freya will take over as the psycho sibling.
She acted cruel and merciless towards Keelin, and told Hayley that Hope was a Mikaelson and she could live without her innocence. She reminded me of Klaus when he was braking the curse and his agenda was all that mattered. He also acted like that when he returned to New Orleans. I don't mean that Elijah is better, I love Elijah but I accept he is a bit of a hypocrite. Sometimes more than a bit. But Freyas behavior reminds me a lot of a paranoid Klaus.
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Post by tissuepaper on Apr 14, 2017 13:43:29 GMT
I think she has been introduced as the female version of Klaus, he had abusive childhood raised by Mikael and she had abusive childhood raised by aunt Dalia. As a result they both have this strong need to cling to the bonds of family. She is human but she is ruthless like Klaus and since he has become father and worries about his daughters opinion I think Freya will take over as the psycho sibling. She acted cruel and merciless towards Keelin, and told Hayley that Hope was a Mikaelson and she could live without her innocence. She reminded me of Klaus when he was braking the curse and his agenda was all that mattered. He also acted like that when he returned to New Orleans. I don't mean that Elijah is better, I love Elijah but I accept he is a bit of a hypocrite. Sometimes more than a bit. But Freyas behavior reminds me a lot of a paranoid Klaus. I think she embodies both brothers in a way, even though I'm starting to see more of Elijah in her than Klaus. Elijah grew up supporting his dad's abuse towards Klaus. The guilt is there and I think more than Klaus, Elijah desires to not be his father. Unfortunately, he's done that by coming off as rational and good, but that undercurrent of ruthlessness is still there. It's all he knows really. He spent his youth support his dad's abuse and then spent centuries support Klaus'. It's kind of sad now that I think about it. He's caught in a vicious cycle and really needs some therapy to help him get out of it. Freya is the same in the sense that she was taken from home and made a lackey for Dahlia's cruel fun. She's probably seen some really horrible stuff and had to play a support role in it. She does come out as somewhat well adjusted on the outside, but she only knows how to be ruthless. You can't fix that overnight. And with Klaus, both were probably abused by their guardian but it's different because Freya knew that she had a family that loved her back home while Klaus had no one. I'd say Klaus is more like Hayley in that they were both abandoned by their 'parents' and sought out a family of their own, but they still have some level of vulnerability to them despite the fact that they've both done some pretty horrible stuff. Sorry for the rambling, I swear it sounds a lot better in my head. |
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Post by Madamimadam on Apr 14, 2017 14:27:03 GMT
I think she has been introduced as the female version of Klaus, he had abusive childhood raised by Mikael and she had abusive childhood raised by aunt Dalia. As a result they both have this strong need to cling to the bonds of family. She is human but she is ruthless like Klaus and since he has become father and worries about his daughters opinion I think Freya will take over as the psycho sibling. She acted cruel and merciless towards Keelin, and told Hayley that Hope was a Mikaelson and she could live without her innocence. She reminded me of Klaus when he was braking the curse and his agenda was all that mattered. He also acted like that when he returned to New Orleans. I don't mean that Elijah is better, I love Elijah but I accept he is a bit of a hypocrite. Sometimes more than a bit. But Freyas behavior reminds me a lot of a paranoid Klaus. I think she embodies both brothers in a way, even though I'm starting to see more of Elijah in her than Klaus.Elijah grew up supporting his dad's abuse towards Klaus. The guilt is there and I think more than Klaus, Elijah desires to not be his father. Unfortunately, he's done that by coming off as rational and good, but that undercurrent of ruthlessness is still there. It's all he knows really. He spent his youth support his dad's abuse and then spent centuries support Klaus'. It's kind of sad now that I think about it. He's caught in a vicious cycle and really needs some therapy to help him get out of it. Freya is the same in the sense that she was taken from home and made a lackey for Dahlia's cruel fun. She's probably seen some really horrible stuff and had to play a support role in it. She does come out as somewhat well adjusted on the outside, but she only knows how to be ruthless. You can't fix that overnight. And with Klaus, both were probably abused by their guardian but it's different because Freya knew that she had a family that loved her back home while Klaus had no one.
I'd say Klaus is more like Hayley in that they were both abandoned by their 'parents' and sought out a family of their own, but they still have some level of vulnerability to them despite the fact that they've both done some pretty horrible stuff.
Sorry for the rambling, I swear it sounds a lot better in my head. I couldnt explain my points clearly but you both summed it up very nicely... Your comparison of how Freya must have been with Dahlia AND Elijah with Mikeal is really interesting. Also Freya is the oldest of the group. She feels protective towards them. When Freya was not there Elijah was the oldest. He feels protective towards them too. And no rambling. I miss these discussions on this board. Do you think that Klaus is starting to see that his family loves him in return? I remember in s2, Hayley and others stood by him against Mikael. Then in s3 end they did the same thing. There has been no blame on him so far LOL. The thing is that we dont know if Hayley was abandoned or she was taken away from her parents even though as per 302 Hayley's words, she was abandoned. From my understanding Hayley and Klaus were not treated well by her adopted and birth parents respectively. Hayley and Freya were taken away from their birth parents. Elijah had both set of parents who loved him but he was forced (probably scared that he will receive the same treatment) to stand by and see one of the parents being cruel to one of his siblings. So Hayley, Freya and Klaus all have issues with their parents sadly. |
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Post by Madamimadam on Apr 14, 2017 15:54:43 GMT
I am not sure if this interviews comes under this heading but I find it interesting since we (me, moonover and Tissuepaper) were discussing Freya and her behavior. Here is the link if you are interested. tvline.com/2017/04/14/the-originals-spoilers-freya-keelin-relationship-season-4-interview/No way. From my understanding and the post I have seen people are not warming up to this particular relationship RIGHT NOW. It is classic case of Stockholm syndrome. TBH Freya being into women TOO came out of blue for me. There was no hint of that until now. She was perfectly into men in s3 and s2, both Marcel and Lucien. Reminds me of Elijah..... Elijah puts his family above all until he met Hayley. He put her first even before he started to see her as family. In 107 he put her before Klaus. Even now Elijah does not really see her as family. |
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Post by moonover on Apr 14, 2017 17:32:00 GMT
I think Hayley grew up believing she was abandoned by her birth parents, although in season one she learns they were killed and father Kieran put her up for adoption. I don't think we know if she was close to her adoptive parents, I think not since in season one she says to Elijah something like, I don't know how to be a mother because I never had a good one. When her adoptive parents kicked her out that was a huge rejection, she probably felt abandoned by them. No rambling, but I understand the feeling, I know what I want to say in my language, but when I have written in English it doesn't sound like it did in my head  . It came out of the blue for me too. Kol even said when he met Freya after resurrection that he thought when he met her in the 19's she was into women because she didn't fancy him, and she laughed at it. |
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Post by moonover on Apr 14, 2017 17:37:23 GMT
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Post by AJ on Apr 15, 2017 4:06:28 GMT
Surprising no one, Marcel and Klaus refused to kill each other. Surprising me, there was no death. I expected it to be either Marcel or his new side dish (what does she want revenge for?), based on the scene in the magic-free bar that somehow is always stocked even when covered in dust.
Also, kinda feeling the vibe between Keelin and Freya.
God damn, Elijah. I mean, always and forever, sure, but there's a perfect example of why people don't like your family.
We have a new plot device! A weapon to take down Originals, in the form of a ...... thorn. Are you fucking kidding me, writers?
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Post by dstormborn on Apr 15, 2017 11:50:34 GMT
Surprising no one, Marcel and Klaus refused to kill each other. Surprising me, there was no death. I expected it to be either Marcel or his new side dish (what does she want revenge for?), based on the scene in the magic-free bar that somehow is always stocked even when covered in dust. Also, kinda feeling the vibe between Keelin and Freya. God damn, Elijah. I mean, always and forever, sure, but there's a perfect example of why people don't like your family. We have a new plot device! A weapon to take down Originals, in the form of a ...... thorn. Are you fucking kidding me, writers? Yeah for a moment they had me believing Marcel was a goner but no. On the other hand the Hollow reminds me a lot of the First of Buffy's last season, as in being incorporeal and using hallucinations instead. And there all the mayor deaths happened during the last episode. It's 2 plot devices, a thorn and a knife (again) to even the odds. At least GOT has cool swords. I think Freya's sexuality is more fluid, women being part of her post Dahlia self discovery like the 100 Clarke or Marissa Cooper. Too bad Stefan can't visit to prove my point ;-) Somehow I'm still hoping the Hollow turns Hope into a weapon of mass destruction, hence all the Lebonair talk. |
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Post by tissuepaper on Apr 15, 2017 15:11:09 GMT
I couldnt explain my points clearly but you both summed it up very nicely... Your comparison of how Freya must have been with Dahlia AND Elijah with Mikeal is really interesting. Also Freya is the oldest of the group. She feels protective towards them. When Freya was not there Elijah was the oldest. He feels protective towards them too. And no rambling. I miss these discussions on this board. Do you think that Klaus is starting to see that his family loves him in return? I remember in s2, Hayley and others stood by him against Mikael. Then in s3 end they did the same thing. There has been no blame on him so far LOL. The thing is that we dont know if Hayley was abandoned or she was taken away from her parents even though as per 302 Hayley's words, she was abandoned. From my understanding Hayley and Klaus were not treated well by her adopted and birth parents respectively. Hayley and Freya were taken away from their birth parents. Elijah had both set of parents who loved him but he was forced (probably scared that he will receive the same treatment) to stand by and see one of the parents being cruel to one of his siblings. So Hayley, Freya and Klaus all have issues with their parents sadly. Isn't Finn older than Elijah? I've always wondered why Elijah took on role of the oldest instead of Finn. For those that watched TVD, did they mention why there? From what I read, Hayley became a wolf and her adopted family kicked her out. She mention in this episode that she grew up in foster care, so she might have been in and out of houses there too. Hopefully we see more of it here, because she needs more backstory. And if the Hollow hates her family, for whatever reason, then maybe that's why she had such a rough childhood. The Hollow could have been following her from way back then. Poor Hope, not only is she part of a family that everyone hates because he dad is kind of crazy, but the other side is cursed by a spirit that will seek her out for eternity. Maybe the Hollow planned for Klaus and Hayley to hook up just for this reason. Maybe they were the ones who made it possible for a hybrid to have a child when it would otherwise be impossible. As for this episode: I didn't really care about the werewolves, though I did like the Guerrera's only they didn't last long, but I'm glad that their story is tying into the main theme for this season. Everything is connected, instead of the werewolves being so separate from the main plot. I liked that the hollow manifested itself into Mikael, Klaus and Elijah. For Klaus, it was obvious that Mikael would be there to torment him and it was fun to watch. Klaus sometimes thinks too highly of himself so it was funny when he tried to troll a troll and lost. He thought he beat Mikael, but the Freya delusion was so on point that even I didn't think it was the hollow at first. As for Marcel, despite what he says he's terrified of Elijah and craves Klaus' acknowledgement. The Hollow using both in tandem was amusing, because it knew that the Elijah delusion would get Marcel worked up, but adding Klaus would cause even more despair. I initially thought that the lady with Marcel worked with the Hollow and was using Marcel, but I'm glad that she just wants to kill Klaus like everyone else. That being said, Marcel should have noticed that the witch she brought was shady considering that the witch's earring looked like the Hollow mark. Marcel's disappointment in Klaus in the end was sad, but it really isn't Klaus causing most of the problems in their relationship. It's Elijah, which is funny because this apparently has been happening since Marcel was a kid. And this might sound wrong, but I could see Elijah pushing Hope away if it meant her connecting with Klaus more and this would just start the same cycle all over again. There are more ways to win than to kill and show no mercy, but Elijah has taken Mikael's words to heart the most and doesn't see any other way. And I think at the end he said all that to Marcel because he was angry at himself. Klaus didn't kill Marcel, but Elijah did. Klaus showed more humanity than Elijah when faced with an impossible choice. I know that Elijah is saying that this means Klaus changed, but doesn't it also mean that Elijah is worse when it comes to being heartless? Some self reflection would do him some good. Same with Freya...though I think they're hoping that Keelin saves her, but it comes off as forced. I hope it turns out that Keelin has some hidden agenda going on. Lastly, I love that the Hollow used Vincent twice. The first time was when Vincent tried to take down Marcel and lost his wife and child in the process, but the second time was when Vincent decided to sever the link to the Ancestors and lost his friends in the process. I wonder what else the hollow made Vincent do? And why Vincent? Overall, I think this was the weakest episode of the season but it was still good. |
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Post by Madamimadam on Apr 15, 2017 16:19:46 GMT
I couldnt explain my points clearly but you both summed it up very nicely... Your comparison of how Freya must have been with Dahlia AND Elijah with Mikeal is really interesting. Also Freya is the oldest of the group. She feels protective towards them. When Freya was not there Elijah was the oldest. He feels protective towards them too. And no rambling. I miss these discussions on this board. Do you think that Klaus is starting to see that his family loves him in return? I remember in s2, Hayley and others stood by him against Mikael. Then in s3 end they did the same thing. There has been no blame on him so far LOL. The thing is that we dont know if Hayley was abandoned or she was taken away from her parents even though as per 302 Hayley's words, she was abandoned. From my understanding Hayley and Klaus were not treated well by her adopted and birth parents respectively. Hayley and Freya were taken away from their birth parents. Elijah had both set of parents who loved him but he was forced (probably scared that he will receive the same treatment) to stand by and see one of the parents being cruel to one of his siblings. So Hayley, Freya and Klaus all have issues with their parents sadly. Isn't Finn older than Elijah? I've always wondered why Elijah took on role of the oldest instead of Finn. For those that watched TVD, did they mention why there? From what I read, Hayley became a wolf and her adopted family kicked her out. She mention in this episode that she grew up in foster care, so she might have been in and out of houses there too. Hopefully we see more of it here, because she needs more backstory. And if the Hollow hates her family, for whatever reason, then maybe that's why she had such a rough childhood. The Hollow could have been following her from way back then. Poor Hope, not only is she part of a family that everyone hates because he dad is kind of crazy, but the other side is cursed by a spirit that will seek her out for eternity.Maybe the Hollow planned for Klaus and Hayley to hook up just for this reason. Maybe they were the ones who made it possible for a hybrid to have a child when it would otherwise be impossible.
As for this episode: I didn't really care about the werewolves, though I did like the Guerrera's only they didn't last long, but I'm glad that their story is tying into the main theme for this season. Everything is connected, instead of the werewolves being so separate from the main plot. I liked that the hollow manifested itself into Mikael, Klaus and Elijah. For Klaus, it was obvious that Mikael would be there to torment him and it was fun to watch. Klaus sometimes thinks too highly of himself so it was funny when he tried to troll a troll and lost. He thought he beat Mikael, but the Freya delusion was so on point that even I didn't think it was the hollow at first. As for Marcel, despite what he says he's terrified of Elijah and craves Klaus' acknowledgement. The Hollow using both in tandem was amusing, because it knew that the Elijah delusion would get Marcel worked up, but adding Klaus would cause even more despair. I initially thought that the lady with Marcel worked with the Hollow and was using Marcel, but I'm glad that she just wants to kill Klaus like everyone else. That being said, Marcel should have noticed that the witch she brought was shady considering that the witch's earring looked like the Hollow mark.Marcel's disappointment in Klaus in the end was sad, but it really isn't Klaus causing most of the problems in their relationship. It's Elijah, which is funny because this apparently has been happening since Marcel was a kid. And this might sound wrong, but I could see Elijah pushing Hope away if it meant her connecting with Klaus more and this would just start the same cycle all over again. There are more ways to win than to kill and show no mercy, but Elijah has taken Mikael's words to heart the most and doesn't see any other way. And I think at the end he said all that to Marcel because he was angry at himself. Klaus didn't kill Marcel, but Elijah did. Klaus showed more humanity than Elijah when faced with an impossible choice. I know that Elijah is saying that this means Klaus changed, but doesn't it also mean that Elijah is worse when it comes to being heartless? Some self reflection would do him some good. Same with Freya...though I think they're hoping that Keelin saves her, but it comes off as forced. I hope it turns out that Keelin has some hidden agenda going on. Lastly, I love that the Hollow used Vincent twice. The first time was when Vincent tried to take down Marcel and lost his wife and child in the process, but the second time was when Vincent decided to sever the link to the Ancestors and lost his friends in the process. I wonder what else the hollow made Vincent do? And why Vincent? Overall, I think this was the weakest episode of the season but it was still good. Finn is older than Elijah but he never really acted like a responsible older sibling. He in fact was trying to kill them, remember? The responsibility of "family" has been on Elijah so far. MN did tweet yesterday that tehy will explore more of what was told in 214 about Hayley's back story but I hope they dont retcon it. There is a theory (I have not seen the current episode so dont know if it really happened or a theory) that Hollow made Jackson grandfather kill Hayley's parents since they were trying to be friendly with vampires and the HOLLOW didnt want it. I guess they are trying to make Jackson's grandparents "good" now. I hope Hollow makes them hookup lol. But I doubt it. Hope is not close to Elijah so far. They have not even yet shared any screen time. Hope thinks the sun rises where her father walks so I dont think he will have to push Hope away from her to make that possible. There was a time when he would have done that with HAYLEY AND HOPE for Klaus to have a family but not anymore. He wants them to be his own family, like we have been saying since the start. I think I read somewhere that he even expressed that desire in last night episode. I dont know Elijah will take any heed to Hayley's advice AND yes he is getting ruthless by the minute. I hear that he was really "nasty" to Marcel. People are even calling it a racist treatment by the writers. I am going to comment on it after I see the episode. |
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Post by ceraleigh on Apr 15, 2017 20:49:55 GMT
I think she has been introduced as the female version of Klaus, he had abusive childhood raised by Mikael and she had abusive childhood raised by aunt Dalia. As a result they both have this strong need to cling to the bonds of family. She is human but she is ruthless like Klaus and since he has become father and worries about his daughters opinion I think Freya will take over as the psycho sibling. She acted cruel and merciless towards Keelin, and told Hayley that Hope was a Mikaelson and she could live without her innocence. She reminded me of Klaus when he was braking the curse and his agenda was all that mattered. He also acted like that when he returned to New Orleans. I don't mean that Elijah is better, I love Elijah but I accept he is a bit of a hypocrite. Sometimes more than a bit. But Freyas behavior reminds me a lot of a paranoid Klaus. I think she embodies both brothers in a way, even though I'm starting to see more of Elijah in her than Klaus. Elijah grew up supporting his dad's abuse towards Klaus. The guilt is there and I think more than Klaus, Elijah desires to not be his father. Unfortunately, he's done that by coming off as rational and good, but that undercurrent of ruthlessness is still there. It's all he knows really. He spent his youth support his dad's abuse and then spent centuries support Klaus'.
It's kind of sad now that I think about it. He's caught in a vicious cycle and really needs some therapy to help him get out of it. Freya is the same in the sense that she was taken from home and made a lackey for Dahlia's cruel fun. She's probably seen some really horrible stuff and had to play a support role in it. She does come out as somewhat well adjusted on the outside, but she only knows how to be ruthless. You can't fix that overnight. And with Klaus, both were probably abused by their guardian but it's different because Freya knew that she had a family that loved her back home while Klaus had no one.I'd say Klaus is more like Hayley in that they were both abandoned by their 'parents' and sought out a family of their own, but they still have some level of vulnerability to them despite the fact that they've both done some pretty horrible stuff. Sorry for the rambling, I swear it sounds a lot better in my head. He tried to stop it, but was threatened to get hit as well. You can not expect kids to stand up to a ruthless adult if other adults wont even. Freya had it WAY worse. She was actually on her own, Klaus had a family. His siblings were scared kids like he was, they couldn't stand up to Mikael and Elijah did try. After they turned, everything that happened to Klaus was his own doing and he lived like a king who was never satisfied. |
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Post by Madamimadam on Apr 15, 2017 22:45:39 GMT
I think she embodies both brothers in a way, even though I'm starting to see more of Elijah in her than Klaus. Elijah grew up supporting his dad's abuse towards Klaus. The guilt is there and I think more than Klaus, Elijah desires to not be his father. Unfortunately, he's done that by coming off as rational and good, but that undercurrent of ruthlessness is still there. It's all he knows really. He spent his youth support his dad's abuse and then spent centuries support Klaus'.
It's kind of sad now that I think about it. He's caught in a vicious cycle and really needs some therapy to help him get out of it. Freya is the same in the sense that she was taken from home and made a lackey for Dahlia's cruel fun. She's probably seen some really horrible stuff and had to play a support role in it. She does come out as somewhat well adjusted on the outside, but she only knows how to be ruthless. You can't fix that overnight. And with Klaus, both were probably abused by their guardian but it's different because Freya knew that she had a family that loved her back home while Klaus had no one.I'd say Klaus is more like Hayley in that they were both abandoned by their 'parents' and sought out a family of their own, but they still have some level of vulnerability to them despite the fact that they've both done some pretty horrible stuff. Sorry for the rambling, I swear it sounds a lot better in my head. He tried to stop it, but was threatened to get hit as well. You can not expect kids to stand up to a ruthless adult if other adults wont even. Freya had it WAY worse. She was actually on her own, Klaus had a family. His siblings were scared kids like he was, they couldn't stand up to Mikael and Elijah did try. After they turned, everything that happened to Klaus was his own doing and he lived like a king who was never satisfied. You are right. He was scared of Mikael for what MIGHT happen to him too. Elijah did try to stop him once (one flashback we saw). Maybe he did other times too but Elijah didnt remain a child during the whole of KLaus's childhood. He was not a child when he helped his parents cursed Klaus. He was scared, I get that but considering that time and age, kids his age (early teens or 12 perhaps) were considered relatively young adults with responsibilities. IIRC Elijah knew how to hunt for food. So he should have known how to defend his siblings too. Freya did have way worse. Klaus situation was bit better. He had siblings to console him and sometimes stood by him too. Inside, Klaus is a scared child just like Freya just like Elijah. Elijah is filled with guilt and that is why he is after Klaus's redemption. He is so focused on Klaus coz of how he couldnt defend him when he COULD. Klaus does not feel loved by his family (esp Elijah) coz they didnt protect him when their father was beating him. I doubt that even as an adult he REALL REALLY understands that they were kids for a part of his childhood and could protect him but what about when they grew up? He is not an idiot. He can see that they dont accept him for who he is. They (Elijah, Rebekah) continuously try to change him. You cannot love a person and try to change that person! Freya was taken away from her family so she craves the love of that family. She wants her family. After they turned or Freya escaped from Dahlia everything they did was on their own doing. No one is responsible for their actions. And no one is satisfied, if you ask me whether they lived like King or not. |
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Post by Madamimadam on Apr 15, 2017 22:54:59 GMT
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