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Post by AJ on Aug 2, 2018 6:45:00 GMT
So, I watched it. And immediately felt that time could have been better used cleaning a toilet, because it amounted to the same thing. But at least afterward I'd have a clean toilet instead of feeling like I've been crapped on.
What the actual hell was that? It's like Plec found some really bad fanfic and decided that would be the finale. We're left with loose threads (Declan just up and vanished, just like the vampires in NOLA, no mention at all of the Crescent pack). We got random cameos. Hayley only shows up for a few seconds and had no lines.
Things I did like:
1. Freya and Keelin will be starting a family.
Things I'm meh about:
1. Marcel/Bex are back on. I'm okay with her eventually becoming human, as it's what she's wanted for a long time now. I've never been a fan of this pairing, they always felt off-kilter because Marcel seemed to choose power instead of her, but they're out of NOLA for good now, it seems, so maybe they'll do better.
Things I didn't like:
Just about everything else.
1. Why was Klaus's sacrifice even necessary? You're telling me they couldn't have found another way, any other way? Maybe divide the Hollow into four parts again, and hide each part into a dark object, and provide each object with protection, in separate corners of the world. But no, they literally killed off Hope's parents within a couple months of each other.
2. Cami and Mikael were distracting and unnecessary. I feel like they could have made a better choice by having Hayley be the one Klaus is hallucinating, giving him guidance (and sarcasm) on dealing with the Hollow and protecting their daughter.
3. Elijah just up and decides he's dying too. He and Klaus both just give up (so does Freya, there's almost no discussion of trying to find a way out of this) and they stake each other. And they don't even burst into flames (remember when Kol became a torch when he got staked?), they go the Voldemort route and just turn into ash and float away. I do kinda suspect they were killed off so people wouldn't ask about them making appearances on the new show. I wouldn't expect many, if at all. Or maybe Joseph and Daniel are just done.
4. It really felt like the writers/producers just gave up in the last two episodes. This season started off strong and just kinda tapered off into a whimper at the end. I look forward to the rush of fanfic that will be posted in response to the shitfest we were just fed.
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Post by Allison on Aug 2, 2018 13:47:35 GMT
I'm processing. I stand by my feelings on the need for an extended fourth season than a fifth but I guess like How I Met Your Mother (sans the stupid Robin epilogue), I'm okay with how the show ended as much as I dearly wanted Klaus to be there. The how Klaus and Elijah died is the unconditional love version of how Stefan and Damon died as humans in the books, feeling the other was responsible for Katherine's 'suicide', they killed each other. I think Cami and Mikael represented who they were meant to and everything I can argue boils down to the fact we had the final few episodes dragged out into insane detail. I think with Rebekah- it's perfect since she always wanted to be human, have children, grow old and die- and she can theoretically change her mind- the choice is hers, instead of taken away.
The death and not seeing what happens next- maybe they'd show up as guest star appearances but at the end of the day the CW burned so many bridges with the cast that it'll take years before we would know, with full availability whether they both would have died. I think it worked for the end of the show and it does the series justice as an ending but with the caveat that other than Legacies for Julie, I don't think we'll see either on a CW show again.
I had a really terrible day and I'm not sure I was up to watching an emotionally draining finale but I do know I have a different perspective as I have from TVD, the reality is I started watching that as a fan of the books- what ended up happening with Jo and the Gemini arc was easily replaceable when it came to Meredith's brother and at least with The Originals, it was the network and sheer logistics than a main actor completely had a female lead role whitewashed and discarded. The other main actor, well- the whole Nina Dobrev having to leave her own show sums it up. I can forgive what they had to give up in this case to finish off the series as opposed to TVD.
As someone who likes Julie Plec's work- my advice to her would be to hand off Legacies and get the hell off the CW, I think on a different network, shows like The Tomorrow People and Containment, shows she can actually make something out of like The Originals, in fact all three would have a better chance of being their own. I think the CW is a dumpster fire of a network, and no matter how hard they try- Supergirl is my cheesy pleasure- I couldn't give a frell over them trying to make their own superhero fad station because I still won't watch their increasing number of superhero shows and Charmed, well- the network has a new flagship show- try raining dumpster fire. The CW didn't even give the show the courtesy of an extended budget for the series finale after demanding their thirteen episodes dragged out like limp noodles.
I'm having a hard time justifying Legacies or Roswell, New Mexico- either they will get ruined by the network or they'll get fucked by the CW and cancelled. Thank everything The Chilling Adventures of Sabrina was given to Netflix. Not on the blame the showrunner train but I'm all aboard the 'let's torch the CW to the fucking ground' train. I'm furious and that the network has the cowardice to reboot a classic they fucked over in its final season doesn't help.
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Post by Daydream on Aug 2, 2018 15:01:48 GMT
So, I watched it. And immediately felt that time could have been better used cleaning a toilet, because it amounted to the same thing. But at least afterward I'd have a clean toilet instead of feeling like I've been crapped on. Best reaction description I've seen.
They tried so hard to make the wolves relevent when we knew they weren't relevent at all. What are the odds Hope's pack, as she's the last of the super-special 'royal' Labonaire line, are even mentioned on the spin-off?
Declan was never important. Just a prop to tell us once again how a good-looking, decent man fell head-over-heels for her super-specialness. A prop to antagonize Klaus with his "I'm her father-figure" schtick. A prop to show that Hope loves someone outside of her family (but not Henry, despite being a pack member. She was just A-OK with walling him up). A prop to share man-pain with Elijah. An easter egg given a story and role that should rightfully have been Cami's.
This entire season felt like really super-fluffy fanfiction.
I don't care. They nerfed Freya so hard; I'm having a hard time caring about her or her HEA, at all. The sister who wanted to be with her family more than anything. Who went through hell before she could finally be with them. Just give up. Doesn't even try. Can't manage to find a way. Nope, I don't care.
UGH - you know what I just thought: their baby's name. I swear, I'll go full on Hulk-rage if they dare name that kid after Elijah or Klaus. And I swear to God, I'm not kidding: I won't be surprised if they him Mikael/Michael.
Tied up with a bow for a sappy illogical HEA. Hate the cure. Hate that Bex wants to be human. Have never been a fan of this ship for the same reasons you stated.
It wasn't. Truthfully, even Elijah's sacrifice wasn't. There were literally dozens of other ways, but they ignored their own mythology for convenience. Not even a couple of months - this entire season took place over a few weeks.
I've heard the same thing about their appearance. They added nothing. This is the issue when you try to cram in fan-service/easter eggs. A disconnect. More questions than answers.
Klaus didn't have growth or development. He died with Mikael voice still in his head. He was never able to move past the abuse. He was never able to let go and beleive in himself - that he could be a good father. Instead, he died with his insecurity intact. He died beleiving this was the best option for his daughter. He died beleiving he was better off dead.
You need to read the Vanity Fair interview JP gave regarding the finale. I'm not going to link it because I refuse to give her the clicks. But in it, she literally blames Joseph and Daniel for their characters ending.
In fact, every interview she gave regarding the finale is nonsense. In VF, she blames the ending on the actors. In another, the reason she didn't go with a Klaroline HEA was to "honor Stefan's memory." It's been 10 years. Caroline is allowed to move on. This woman's notion of romance is steeped in patriarchy.
In another, apparently entire premise of the show was about ELIJAH'S JOURNEY. Who knew?
This woman is a terrible, terrible, terrible showrunner.
Fans will never stop asking about Klaus, Elijah, Haylijah, or Klaroline.
And I have no doubt that Joseph and Daniel are done.
They absolutely did give up - on this entire season. They ignored their own mythology for the sake of convenience and coincidence. OMG - did you see that picture of them that Klaus took with the poloroid camera when Hope was a baby?!?!?! KLAUS BURNED THAT PHOTO seconds after it was taken.
I'm looking forward to the FF as well. And the art. Such creative people out there; it's amazing.
I forgot to login again, but it's me.
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Post by daydreamer on Aug 2, 2018 15:15:21 GMT
Joseph posted a video:
In it, I think it's pretty clear that he preferred "dark" Klaus and his family bond with Elijah and Rebekah. I think he was hoping TO would be darker and more mature - and it ended up a dumpster fire. That's my opinion, at least.
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Post by AJ on Aug 2, 2018 15:40:41 GMT
I went diving for that Vanity Fair interview and couldn't find it. But it doesn't surprise me she'd throw them under the bus. Anything to not make herself look bad.
I get Bex wanting to be human, she's said it for a long time now. I'm okay with her taking the cure, and I basically don't care if she's with Marcel. She obviously isn't ready to get off that merry-go-round.
And poor Aurora, lying there in that house serving absolutely no purpose. She could have been used as a Hollow container, but nope.
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Post by Madamimadam on Aug 2, 2018 18:43:05 GMT
LOL...
I actually get Freya giving up. I would call that actual growth in her character. Her dependency on her family coming to an end. She has been trying to fight for them for so long. They are all poison to each other. IT is about time to cut your limbs least they harm her too. She deserves to live a happy life with her love.
I also read about JP saying that the only reason both died was because of actors choices to not continue with their role. What the ever loving...... I mean I am A-Okay with them dying but the way they died was totally abstract. I mean I get why Klaus had to die but Elijah? Really? I am not buying that he decided to die because of his dependency on Klaus or he was tired. I think his reason had to do a lot about Hayley. Ian and Nina didnt want to continue with their characters. They didnt die. Its like she decided while shooting of 512 that they both will die so how to get about it. O well let them kill each other with no solid reason. Just kill each other with I am tired and I cannot live without you reason.....
Is Ian or Nina being pestered? Yes but is it i big deal? IMO their death would have made sense if it was due to some REAL reason. I mean Klaus maybe had a reason but Elijah, nope. I dont think so
I agree with you about Klaroline about Stefan's dead and his memory not being the reason for them being together. The thing is yes it has been 10 years since he has died and Caroline could have moved on, easily but Klaroline development that happened in s5 was too rushed hence I can see why she didnt want to go ahead with Klaroline. I mean 10 years were bts. There was no on screen interaction and development between them for the past 10 years so what we saw in season 5 in current time (after 10 year time jump) was toooooo rushed.
Whats there to ask? Haylijah happened in afterlife. Caroline did love KLaus when he died but she is happy for him and has moved on. And she definitely will remember him. Not just him all of them. Klaus, yes he will remember her too. And I can easily see Mikeal and Cami hog him in afterlife just like they did in actual life. All the drama in their life will continue in afterlife. Oh and Klamille is endgame there untill Caroline dies and appears but as JP mentioned in her interview "people can learn to love and move on another person" (paraphrasing)
The bold part. Hayley telling KLaus not to kill Hope would have been an obvious answer since Hope is her daughter but again the show writers wanted to force things on us rather than do the logical.
yes poor her but Klaus dying was a sacrifice he was doing for his daughter; a growth in his character IMO. By doing what you are proposing with Aurora wouldnt have send a message.
Joseph did like the dark Klaus but really he need to be more flexible in his thinking about redemption to some extent.
People are really upset about that!! LOL but maybe they took another one afterwards. O well not a big deal since they ignored many BIGGER stuff.
Klaus died for his daughter without harming her in the end inspite of Mikeal muttering in his ear. I think that is a big development. He could have harmed her while dying. Couldnt he? Unpopular opinion but I agree with Klaus about Hope being better of without him. He has not been a good father. yes he learned many things. He learned to love her when he was okay with her dying at the start of show but he has not been a GOOD influence on her. He is also a danger to her constantly. Not a good role model either.
I am to this day upset with them not really really exploring RED DOOR. I can see how she can see it as Elijah's journey too.
People generally are very unhappy with the ending. Strangely a lot of them are okay with Klaus's death (because he had a reason.. Hollow being in him) but Elijah's death and HOW he died made it useless.
I wonder how CECE is taking it. We used to discuss about Klaus's dead and now it has happened.
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Post by AJ on Aug 2, 2018 19:10:23 GMT
Yeah, I'm not fussing about the picture because they ignored larger, more important things. The Voldemort death irritated the hell out of me, Finn and Kol became bonfires when they died.
And I get that they wanted the message to be 'Klaus sacrifices himself so his daughter can live'. What pisses me off is the general attitude among the rest of the characters that this was inevitable, and no one even TRIED to find an alternative. Everyone just shrugged their shoulders.
I still want to know what happens to Bex's sire line when she takes the cure. Do they all become human again? Do they die off? Do they stay as they are? If they all die off, then the only vamps left will be Klaus's broken sire line. There have been three mass-extinctions of vampires now. The rest have to be nervous if they'll be next.
As to Joseph and Daniel electing to wrap things up with their characters - no, that didn't mean they had to be killed off. As stated, Damon and Elena were given a HEA. Why was this the ending Plec thought was the only rational way to end it? I'm sad to say that I'm glad this show is done, so now I can basically walk away from CW shows and find better uses of my time.
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Post by Madamimadam on Aug 2, 2018 19:31:00 GMT
Really? Why? I always knew he would die. For me it was always the question of if Hayley will survive or not? Was the WAY he died that bothered you?
yep. I cannot imagine the first or second (?) Original who died is going to live forever lol.
Like I said it has been Freya for a while fighting for her family. Elijah has been useless at this point. Same goes for Rebekah. Kol was never too bothered. And Freya just got too tired to try anything else. Its an unending cycle with her family. As for Klaus he was bend upon the sacrifice. Could Elijah have transfered the Hollow inside him?
NOthing happens to it I guess until she dies natural death IMO. How did they kil Klaus link to his line? Maybe they will do it again once Rebekah takes the care if by that time Freya is still alive?
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Post by tissuepaper on Aug 2, 2018 19:40:23 GMT
Well...at least Klaus isn't a deadbeat dad anymore. He's just dead.
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Post by tissuepaper on Aug 2, 2018 20:02:57 GMT
Here are my actual thoughts about the entire thing. I'm not shocked, nor am I disappointed. It is what it is, right? I think this entire season has been incredibly lacklustre and didn't feel true to what the Originals was from the beginning, but it's also because of this that the ending doesn't have the same sort of sucker punch for me as it does others. I stopped caring early on, so the ending happened and now I can focus on other things.
The Originals has always been about family, but this season was all about Legacies and TVD fans.
I think this season could have been so much better. The nazi vampires were a complete waste of time. It would have been better if the Hollow was the main villain the entire time. The idea that you have to let the Hollow die with someone is fine, but they had Aurora still locked in a wall somewhere. They could have put the Hollow in her and be done with it.
For Klaus to take it upon himself makes sense for the character, but it also means that Klaus is running away again. He almost reminds me of Jack from This is Us, Klaus, like Jack, feel like the best way to show that he loves someone is to do these grandiose gestures....and then expects people to praise him for it. The Hollow could have been solved right away, but Klaus has to do it his way because he's Klaus.
I agree with AJ above, as much as I liked seeing Cami again, it would have made more sense for Hayley to be the one telling Klaus to fight the Hollow. Out of everyone, I feel like she'd be the one to tell him to live and stop being so melodramatic. Hayley's death, which I still hated, was done because there was no other choice. Klaus was out, Hope was out and everyone was an enemy. She had no other option. Klaus had multiple options, but chose not to use any of them.
He deserved to die and I do think that the ending with his death makes a lot of sense, but this wasn't a growing moment for him. Klaus is just running away and using this as a means to show his daughter that he's not all bad.
Speaking of which, Hope must feel horrible. Her plan on getting her dad back resulting in the death of her mom, her father and uncle. Klaus' enemies will go after her now, because that's how they are. She kind of has Declan, but I mean...he was a complete waste of space and time wasn't he? Poor guy. Also, what was the point of Antoinette?
...I don't really like Freya and Keelin. Keelin was imprisoned and tortured and somehow fell in love with her captor. That's weird. I feel bad that Vincent is now forced to stay with them when he really needs to go to a secluded island away from everything and everyone.
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Post by AJ on Aug 2, 2018 23:47:07 GMT
Inconsistent with previous Original deaths - Finn and Kol (when they were killed in their Original form) literally burst into flames. To have Elijah and Klaus just turn into ash and float away like Voldemort was annoying. These last two or three episodes really felt like the writers just gave up, and as a result so did the characters. No one tried to fight, and there was this sudden acceptance of death that's not in character.
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Post by AJ on Aug 2, 2018 23:51:48 GMT
The idea that you have to let the Hollow die with someone is fine, but they had Aurora still locked in a wall somewhere. They could have put the Hollow in her and be done with it. I feel bad that Vincent is now forced to stay with them when he really needs to go to a secluded island away from everything and everyone. Right? Put the Hollow in Aurora and then stake her. Problem solved. I don't feel bad for Vincent, it was his choice to stay in NOLA and provide DNA for Freya and Keelin. He had the chance, should have taken it. But, with the Original vampires (and all the other vampires), NOLA should be rather peaceful.
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