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Post by AJ on May 24, 2018 0:19:48 GMT
The Originals- 5.06 'What, Will, I, Have, Left' Discussion Thread
THE RACE TO SAVE HAYLEY — After learning how she can get Hayley back, Hope sets off on a dangerous mission to end the mess she started. Klaus turns to Caroline for help when he discovers Hope's plan. Vincent and Freya clash over whether to let Declan in on New Orleans's supernatural secrets.
I have to say I'm not really looking forward to it. All signs point to tonight being when shit hits the fan.
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Post by Allison on May 24, 2018 13:09:48 GMT
There's no new episode this week which is why I held off on posting straight away.  Also was moving and without my internet properly till tonight (I was actually grateful for the off week falling this one)- with your okay, I'll tidy up this, I'll leave your comment but add the episode description and formatting for the thread. |
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Post by AJ on May 24, 2018 23:44:52 GMT
Yep, go ahead. I didn't realize til much later that this was an off week.
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Post by Allison on May 25, 2018 23:57:44 GMT
Done... also, was good because I was not prepared for all the waterworks watching the Once Upon A Time series finale and if this is the episode where I have to watch one of my favourite characters die while Hope suffers what her father did by way of having her werewolf side suppressed- none of the tears will be dignified. Hayley's a good mother in terms of the fact Hope knows she loves her no matter what which is somewhat rare in this universe- the problem is that loss, unlike her father, Hope knows her parents- everybody who loves her have sacrificed and have done everything for her. Hope's parents are so much bigger in her world and it's not fair. She needs both of them and this twisted eugenic vampiric family (from the sounds of it, Antoinette is an unwilling member and an exception) took advantage because they find that part of her disgusting and would destroy Hope as a person to fix her like Esther 'fixed' Niklaus.
If Josh is anything but contrite this episode 'growls'- it's a pity vampires can heal getting their faces slashed up.
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Post by tissuepaper on May 30, 2018 22:16:41 GMT
I'm not able to watch at the moment, but I'll be looking forward to your thoughts.
With the way things are going, I don't know if I'll like this season, but I'm still hopeful....kind of.
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Post by AJ on May 31, 2018 2:21:44 GMT
About to watch it, but the promo for next ep is already up and WHAT THE FUCK IS ELIJAH DOING?!
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Post by AJ on May 31, 2018 4:05:36 GMT
Welp. Knew it was coming, still kinda hard to watch.
I don't expect Roman to survive the next episode. And I wonder if Hope's wolf side will trigger - you don't have to be a murderer, just in some way responsible for someone's death, and it could be argued that Hope was in some way responsible for Hayley. Also, Hayley's talk about how it feels to run as a wolf seems like too big a hint to just drop.
I don't understand this whole Declan thing. We only have 7 episodes, that's not enough time to develop him into anything, unless they're just gonna drop him in the anti-vampire brigade Elijah apparently joins/creates. FFS, writers.
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Post by Allison on May 31, 2018 13:23:21 GMT
Hayley's death was hard to watch- it wasn't passive, I think it'd be easier if I could just be angry about it (also sans migraine). She fought so hard to save Hope and do everything she could for them... frelling hell today was not a good day for me- migraine so my entire face is pins and needles and I feel wretched without watching one of my favourite characters sacrifice herself to save her daughter. I'm grateful they didn't have it somehow fix Elijah because it lets her death be more about Hayley herself and what she believed in (family) than about a ship.
I think Declan's either going to develop as someone to finally be a voice for the humans in this whole united factions they're going for or as you say, part of the anti impurity vampire drama. No idea but I'm willing to go on a little faith. I'll have more thoughts later- I just need to lay down but Vincent's point had him bring up his own downfall- compulsion doesn't fix anything and he has his own part in what ultimately happened to Hayley and the deaths leading up to it. Elijah didn't know better- Antoinette, I'm on the fence over now because her context is becoming clearer and she was less her own person this week than a former brainwash victim who can't break free of her past and unless she can, I can't see her and Elijah working out in the long term.
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Post by Daydreamer47 on May 31, 2018 18:26:10 GMT
On vacation. Will go in depth later. For now, I'll leave you with this: Declan. Is Cami's cousin. And it looks like Declan - very much a man - will get the storyline Cami very much deserved. {Insert massive eyeroll here.}
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Post by AJ on May 31, 2018 23:11:33 GMT
Hayley's death was hard to watch- it wasn't passive, I think it'd be easier if I could just be angry about it (also sans migraine). She fought so hard to save Hope and do everything she could for them... frelling hell today was not a good day for me- migraine so my entire face is pins and needles and I feel wretched without watching one of my favourite characters sacrifice herself to save her daughter. I'm grateful they didn't have it somehow fix Elijah because it lets her death be more about Hayley herself and what she believed in (family) than about a ship. I think Declan's either going to develop as someone to finally be a voice for the humans in this whole united factions they're going for or as you say, part of the anti impurity vampire drama. No idea but I'm willing to go on a little faith. I'll have more thoughts later- I just need to lay down but Vincent's point had him bring up his own downfall- compulsion doesn't fix anything and he has his own part in what ultimately happened to Hayley and the deaths leading up to it. Elijah didn't know better- Antoinette, I'm on the fence over now because her context is becoming clearer and she was less her own person this week than a former brainwash victim who can't break free of her past and unless she can, I can't see her and Elijah working out in the long term. You know, Klaus was right. Put a doe-eyed brunette in front of Elijah and he stops using his brain. Even with the compulsion and not remembering, the whole situation should have rang an alarm. He knows the family Antoinette came from, that they're vampire supremacists, and that Hope is a hybrid. And now, even seeing Hayley do what she did, he's joining them and seemingly going after Klaus. And to think I was excited that Elijah was getting some kind of life away from his family. Of course it all had to be ruined. Fucking Nazi vampires. Hope you feel better soon, Allison. |
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Post by daydreamer on Jun 1, 2018 23:43:57 GMT
The no secret edition....
It's no secret I love Klaroline. Loved seeing the clips of those two together again. But as a ... writer? adult? IDK, whatever, but I had some issues with the dialogue. Specifically the "if there was a bad boy within a five mile radius..." line. Human Caroline was interested in Damon before he compelled her. But Vampire Caroline was not into bad boys. Matt? Pfffttt... Tyler? Tyler wasn't a bad boy, he was a rich-kid douche who became better when he turned. Stefan?! Give me a break. Stefan wasn't a bad boy. Stefan had issues controlling his bloodlust and occasionally turned off his emotions. Jesse - not a bad boy. The only bad boy she ever liked was Klaus. I just really hated that line. I would've liked something more direct and connected to them (Klaus and Caroline).
It's no secret I can't stand Hayley or Haylijah. But. But - they did her wrong. IDK if there was behind-the-scenes drama or if it was simply contractual issues or time issues, but they did her wrong. She's the one you brought to the dance. She's the horse you backed for four seasons, at the expense of everyone else.
There's part of me that thinks, okay, she's had her run, now it's Hope's turn to shine. Hope is the new special. And once Hope became a teen, what more was there for Hayley?
That said, it was a great death. And what I keep thinking is that Hayley is alone in this moment. When she was first introduced on TVD, she was the lone wolf, the wolf who didn't depend on anyone - who learned not to depend on anyone. And in the end, she had to take care of business herself. I think that's sad.
And Elijah - people so mad an Elijah, who literally does not remember the feelings he had for her. I think some people thought that once Elijah saw Hayley again, he'd remember/fall for her all over again and no. Nope. Nothing. He looked at her curiously, that's it. Elijah, free from his memories, free from family, free from the knowledge that this woman was pregnant with his niece, felt nothing. Which goes back something I've always maintained: he would not have fallen for her had she not been pregnant with his brother's child. Honestly, he looked at Caroline's lifeless body with more emotion, IMO.
These Nazi vampires need to go. They focus so much on Hope and Hayley, but not Marcel?
If they do a Happily Everafter Life scene, I really hope that we see Hayley with her parents. The ones that started her on this path in the first place.
I honestly don't think Elijah or Klaus will die. I think this is the "moral" of the story: They survive, no matter what. They love, and they lose the ones they love. Loving a Mikaelson is a death sentence. But no matter what, they survive. Together. Always and forever.
And I don't believe in a single soulmate for anyone - vampire or human. Elijah loved Tatia and he was directly responsible for her death. He got over it. And he eventually fell in love again. He loved Celeste, yet forgave his brother and eventually got over it. And he fell in love again, with Hayley. He's indirectly responsible for her death. He will feel a massive amount of pain and guilt, but he will eventually get over it. And he will fall in love again. It will take time, but he will fall in love again. I'm just pissed we won't see it.
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Post by AJ on Jun 2, 2018 4:12:46 GMT
It felt pretty gross to me to have all that fluffy Klaroline shit in the lead-up to Hayley dying.
I get that Elijah didn't have his memories, but he also lost his critical thinking skills. I really think that this situation should have rang alarm bells for him, instead of him automatically assuming Greta was on the up and up. I'm also confused, since the spoiler we saw that told us Hayley was gonna die said that her death would bring back Elijah's memories, and the promo shows us no sign of that. But I have read that he will remember and have to deal with his role in her death. As for the romance between them, it was always shoehorned in and nonsensical.
I think the reason they're not going after Marcel is that they can't go after Marcel. He has no known weakness, and they don't seem stupid enough to try random stuff to see what sticks. And if they do try and fail, he can ensure their deaths are excruciating. Right now I expect they're doing research on that front. They're also not after Klaus (yet - the promo hints that Elijah joins them and they at least make an attempt), who could in theory make hybrids as well. We don't know for sure that avenue is closed to him.
I hope Hayley does get a happily-ever-after of a kind with her family, and probably Jackson. I'm glad that Hayley went out on her own terms and protecting her daughter, but fuck if that death didn't feel cheap, especially since it was seemingly secondary to the Klaroline road show.
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Post by tissuepaper on Jun 2, 2018 12:50:47 GMT
If the spoilers are true, then Elijah's guilt will make him sacrifice himself in Klaus' place. So he's going to die and be reunited with Hayley...which is bleh. This will cause a lot of vampires to just vanish too, so I wonder if they'll address that. I'd rather Klaus die. I think a great end scene would be Klaus and Hayley somehow being able to see Hope okay and they're happy. It's not romantic, but it would bring a full circle to two characters who were always alone and wanted to do right by their daughter, by dying on her behalf and 'watching' over her. We were robbed of a family scene between the three of them, so Id be okay if it was like that. It would also be a great lesson for Hope as well. Hope would realize that being like Klaus isn't the best and that her actions have severe consequences. I'd also like a world without Klaus in it, just to see how everyone else deals with the villain being gone. Elijah, with his memories, may be different than the Elijah we got. Rebekah and Marcel could be together and Freya would be stress free sine there's no family drama anymore. Kol doesn't care, but he'll most likely be the one in Hope's life the most. And Vincent, the guy was about to have a stroke so this would save him the most.
ps. plus there's no romance and the show goes back to being about family.
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Post by daydreamer on Jun 2, 2018 13:27:31 GMT
 This may seem long and rambling, but I have a point: I used to watch the new show 911 on Fox. I loved it - it was a different kind of cop/firefighter procedural. These types of shows normally are not my thing, but I loved the cast and the stories. Until. Two characters, Buck (a firefighter) and Abby (a 911 operator) meet in person for the first time. Abby's mom has Alzheimer's and wandered off. Abby is distraught and Buck comes over to help. The two of them get in the car and start searching the streets. This is a crisis - Abby is distraught; Buck is worried for Abby...and then they start having a very personal conversation about sex. And that was the moment I was done.
So I do understand how you feel about the Klaroline scenes; especially in the midst of TWO very serious situations (Hayley's missing and now Hope has run away).
That said...only Caroline can make him relax. Smile like that. Take his mind off of all the drama. Even for just a few moments. And I did like seeing Klaus relaxed and happy and smiling for just a moment. I'm sorry, but I'm tired of his man-pain and constant daddy issues and self-inflicting angst.
You're absolutely right about his critical thinking skills. 100%. The only excuse I can come up with is that he's a clean slate and dependent upon Antoinette/others and their POV. But you're absolutely right; the entire situation should have set off interal alarms within him, even if he didn't remember Hayley.
The spoilers we saw were from the very beginning of shooting, so I think they may have changed it slightly. I'm actually interested in seeing how memory-less Elijah deals with the aftermath. Will he confront or comfort Antoinette? Will he learn that he and Hayley were in love? Interested to see where that goes.
Yeah, I know. But if they have these so-called powerful witches on their side, they can subdue Marcel.
I'm thinking more and more that there's going to be a massive eyeroll with how the Hollow situation is wrapped up. All this effort by Freya for the past few years and nothing. Yet I have a feeling that when Hope gets emotional enough, she'll just *poof* destroy the Hollow.
I thought about her seeing Jackson again and just how pissed off the Haylijah fans would be in that moment. Not only killing her, but then reuniting her with Jackson? Whether it's platonic or not, I don't see that going over well.
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Post by daydreamer on Jun 2, 2018 13:45:55 GMT
If I understand correctly, Elijah's line already died back in S4 when he "died."
That's one spoiler I really hope isn't true. I can see it happening, but I truly hope it isn't true. This family has survived so much and suddenly, they can't survive THIS? Nazi vampires? Give me a freakin' break. It's really going to piss me off if this spoiler is true.
Oh - what I want to see, though? Is one big battle scene. All the Mikaelsons, at their fierciest, taking on these assholes. The Mikaelson siblings fighting side-by-side, together.
My theories: I think they're going to do flashbacks of Klaus and Hayley talking about Hope. Maybe even flashback to when they were together when Hope was still a child. I also think there will be flashbacks of Hayley and Hope talking about Klaus and how he loves her. And I think there will be one of Hayley visiting Elijah in France.
But truth be told, 1) I really don't want Klaus to die LOL and 2) I really don't want to see the cheesy Happily Ever Afterlife scenes - it's the same thing they did on TVD. Cheesy and fan-service-y and not necessary. The only one that makes sense to me is Hayley finally meeting her parents. That one makes sense to me because that's the end of her journey. Her quest started back on TVD and was all about finding her parents and the truth about herself.
I don't think Elijah could survive without Klaus. Elijah would self-destruct. Klaus has a better chance of surviving without Elijah because Klaus would still have Hope to live for. But even then, as it's been shown and said: Klaus doesn't do well without Elijah.
Rebekah and Marcel's relationship doesn't even come into play anymore; Klaus gave his blessing 100 years ago, and again in S4. It isn't Klaus that's keeping them apart right now. It was Rebekah's decision.
Who knew that it would be Kol, of all people, to be in Hope's life the most? Good for him. The only redeeming thing I like about him.
And I could care less about Vincent.
But it's not just Klaus who is the villain in this story. It's all of them. So even if Klaus were gone, the others would still have to deal with whatever enemies they have left.
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Also was moving and without my internet properly till tonight (I was actually grateful for the off week falling this one)- with your okay, I'll tidy up this, I'll leave your comment but add the episode description and formatting for the thread.
This may seem long and rambling, but I have a point: I used to watch the new show 911 on Fox. I loved it - it was a different kind of cop/firefighter procedural. These types of shows normally are not my thing, but I loved the cast and the stories. Until. Two characters, Buck (a firefighter) and Abby (a 911 operator) meet in person for the first time. Abby's mom has Alzheimer's and wandered off. Abby is distraught and Buck comes over to help. The two of them get in the car and start searching the streets. This is a crisis - Abby is distraught; Buck is worried for Abby...and then they start having a very personal conversation about sex. And that was the moment I was done.